In this series of Group Thinkers podcast episodes, our focus is on leadership. Throughout each episode, we’ll chat with leaders in the nonprofit and commercial space to learn more about their careers and the unique journeys that led them to where they are today.
On this episode, we sit down with Tony Martignetti, host of Nonprofit Radio, to discuss:
Founder of Martignetti Planned Giving and Host of Nonprofit Radio
“It's all about people; it's all about listening to people, being curious, being curious about people. You know, if you have a curiosity about anything, you'll explore it. And I have a curiosity about people.”
Justin: Alright. Welcome to Group Thinkers, the podcast from RKD Group. I am your host, Justin McCord. With me as always is Ronnie Richard. And on today's episode, we have, he said not a pioneer; I'm gonna say he's a pioneer. Tony Martignetti of Nonprofit Radio. He is a pioneer in the nonprofit marketing landscape in terms of podcasting, but he's more than that and has a super interesting story. Ronnie, tell us a little bit about Tony.
Ronnie: Yeah, like you said, Tony has an incredibly interesting story. So, he graduated from college, and he was there on behalf of the Air Force. And so, he joined the Air Force, and he tells us a little bit about this on our episode. Held the launch keys to nuclear missiles. So, I mean, that's a pretty hefty responsibility. I'm thinking about myself coming out of college. I don't know if I would've wanted my younger self to be in charge of that.
But then after serving, he came back and went to law school, started a law career, didn't find, you know, that to be very fulfilling. And then kinda got into planned giving and working at universities, and it's really taken off from there, and he started the podcast, and he kinda has this theme that he talks about where he learned something, and then he just keeps going with it because he doesn't wanna learn something new. So, yeah, there's definitely that kind of running through the entire episode.
Justin: Yeah, yeah. You know, it's funny, Ronnie, I've known of Tony for a long time from his presence and association with the Nonprofit Technology Network and physical presence on-site conducting interviews and live streaming from the NTC conference. And so, it's interesting to unpack his story for me and learn his path into this nonprofit radio space. Some things to listen for: One is the element of curiosity and how that plays into it. Second, is, as you said, the long game.
You know, starting your career, starting your nonprofit career in planned giving consulting, is not a traditional path, let's say, and it's definitely learning the long game really quick. But so is starting a podcast in 2010 and continuing to do it 650 episodes later. That's a long game. And then the last thing that stood out to me is the role that inspiration plays.
And there's kind of this interesting cycle of, you know, curiosity in the long game into inspiration that I find to be moving as a part of Tony's work.
Ronnie: Yeah. Same. I mean, he talks about the people who have inspired him, the donors who inspire him, all have kind of found contentment in their life. And so, like you said, it's the cycle of curiosity that it's seeking something, it's seeking contentment. And it's really fascinating to kinda hear that thread run through everything. So everyone, yeah, here’s our episode with Tony Martignetti. Enjoy.
Justin: Ronnie, have you ever been intimidated by one of our guests?
Ronnie: Yeah. Yeah. Definitely.
Justin: Tony, we're not, we're not intimidated. We're not intimidated.
Tony: I hope not. I hope not.
Ronnie: Let's go with impressed.
Justin: Yeah, yeah, for sure impressed, but here's the thing: Like, we've been at this thing for four years; you're one of the forerunners in audio format for nonprofit marketing discussions.
Tony: I was an early adopter ... probably not a pioneer. I was an early adopter of podcasting. Absolutely. I started podcasting in July of 2010.
Justin: That's incredible. How many guests have you had on?
Tony: Oh, thousands. We're coming up on show number 650 in July because every … you know, I do 50 a year times 13 years is 650 shows. And thousands of guests.
Justin: So cool.
Tony: Thank you. Thank you. It's great fun. It's all for the benefit of small and mid-sized nonprofits.
Justin: Yeah. Yeah. Tony Martinetti's Nonprofit Radio. You can find it on all sorts of different platforms, and you know, I think it served even as an inspiration early on in, you know, 2018 when we were starting to plan this thing in 2019 and getting it off the ground. And even remembering having been to NTEN, to NTC, and, you know, in the mid 2010s, and seeing you recording live.
So, you are amongst those that have paid attention along the way, just so that you know.
Tony: I'm glad. I'm happy to inspire other valuable nonprofit podcasts. Absolutely. And my secret is, you know, I latch onto something, and then I don't let go.
That's why I figure out how to do something, and then I don't wanna stop doing it because it's gonna require me to learn something new to replace it. No. I don't wanna do that. So, podcasting thirteen years.
You mentioned NTEN and the Nonprofit Technology Conference, NTC. There are great folks there. I still go to their conferences. I was just at the one in Denver eight weeks ago, and I was doing them back in 2016 or so. 2015, something like that, was my first one. You know, I learn something, and then I, I don't wanna learn something new. So just stay with it.
Justin: That's alright. So today, we're gonna spend some time, you know, really, you know, as I said beforehand, unpacking, you know, your journey and some of the things that you have held on to along the way and talk about some of the people that have shaped you, etcetera. And so honestly, man, where I wanna start, Tony, is I wanna start before the radio program. I wanna start before the planned giving work. And I wanna start with the codes to the nuclear missiles.
So, like, if you can, just draw a line from that, how you ended up with said codes, and then take us from there into your planned giving career. From the Air Force into planned giving?
Tony: I had an ROTC scholarship to Carnegie Mellon University. So that's what got me into the Air Force. The Air Force paid for my college degree. So I owed them time in return. I spent an extra year beyond the four required. I spent five years in the Air Force. And I was assigned by the United States Air Force to operate minuteman missile weapon, nuclear missiles under the grounds of Warrensburg, Missouri. That's where I was stationed, Whitman Air Force Base, Warrensburg, Missouri, and you start as a deputy missile combat crew commander, and you work your way up to missile combat crew commander, without being the deputy, being the commander. And, yeah, so you have the keys to ten nuclear missiles. And off duty, the keys started my Toyota. So they worked, they did double duty.
Yeah. That was my assigned job. I had a degree in economics and information systems from Carnegie Mellon, but I got assigned to minute man nuclear missiles. And that's what I did, that's what I did for five years in in Missouri, then I went to law school, loved law school, I wish law school was four years instead of only three. I love the study of law. Practice of law did not suit me at all. I only lasted two years. I was miserable. So, I'm still very glad I went to law school. I still encourage people to go to law school.
Law is a wonderful career, and there's a lot you can do with a law degree, thankfully, besides practicing law because I needed an alternative. Because practicing law just didn't suit me. Found it to be a very unpleasant way to make a lot of money. So, two years, then I reengineered myself into something that where I thought my degree would be helpful, and it was planned giving fundraising. And there's a …
Justin: How? How did that line connect? Like, how did you get from practicing law to a niche area within the niche area? Planned giving within, like, the nonprofit marketing fundraising space?
Tony: Well, desperation breeds creativity. I needed something to make money, and I couldn't stand practicing law much longer. Also, I had a career consulting business. Today, you’d call me a career coach. But from 1994-1997, roughly, we didn't have career coaches. So, I just called myself a career consultant.
And I was helping other lawyers who were miserable practicing law to find a happier life using their skills. And so, that business did mediocre. I didn't see the value of networking, and I paid for a lot of advertising and sat back and waited for the phone to ring. So, a lot of a lot of lessons learned in that business applied in my current business. Thankfully. I can learn, see, but once I learn something, then I don't wanna let it go. That's why.
Justin: Yeah. You don't wanna let it go.
Tony: This is the theme. 26 years in planned giving, thirteen years podcasting, NTEN conferences times coming up on nine or ten years. I can't let things go. So--
Justin: It's, so I'm gonna play it back to the planned giving thing though, it's that you like to play the long game. Right? Like, that's it, it’s that you're, you like playing the long game with it because, you know, a big part of planned giving is the art of the long game. Of understanding that and the nuances of it. So, I think that you just excel at the long game.
Tony: You're very gracious. I wish I had, I wish I could say that I was thinking of that at the time. I was just, I was not. I was looking for something where I could apply my legal skills, take some of my own career consulting advice.
So, I looked into fundraising and then, specifically, planned giving because there is a legal side to it, but I hasten to add that you do not have to be a lawyer to be successful in planned giving. You don't have to have a lawyer on your board or anywhere near your small or mid-sized nonprofit to be enormously successful in planned giving.
That's a very, very important takeaway. That's just, that's what led me to planned giving was the legal side of it, but you don't need to have any expertise or hire legal expertise to be successful in planned giving.
Ronnie: Yeah. So you worked in planned giving at universities, right? It was, it was Iona and St. John's, if I remember correctly. And you kinda, I guess you could say, kinda cut your teeth learning planned giving. Right? And then you started your own consulting business helping nonprofits with planned giving. How did that kinda come about? And, like, what did, what did you learn during your time at the universities?
Tony: You all did your research. Thank you very much, Ronnie. Yeah. I learned how to launch planned giving programs. You're absolutely right. I started at Iona College, which is now Iona university in New Rochelle, New York―West Chester County outside New York City―and I launched the planned giving program there. They had, they had nothing.
And I got it started. And then I moved after about a year and a half, roughly a year, year and a half, somewhere in there. I moved to St. John’s University in Queens, Queens County, New York, and launched the planned giving program there.
And I stayed there for five years, building that, launching it and building that program. So, I learned how to launch planned giving programs. I know how to start the promotion, how to motivate the board, that's important around planned giving, how to train the other fundraisers, especially at Saint John's. That was a university at the time. It was a much bigger development shop. So, I would train my fellow gift officers in opening conversations with their prospects and their donors about the potential of planned gifts, and then we would work together if there was interest.
So, I learned how to, I learned how to launch, and that's what I've been doing since as a consultant. I started consulting in 2003 when I left Saint John's University. So this is my twentieth year in consulting and my twenty-sixth year in in planned giving overall. Can't let go.
Justin: The guy just can't let go.
Ronnie: Well, you learned something, and then you kept doing it, like you said.
Tony: Yeah, that's true. Yes.
Ronnie: I'm curious though, like, who did you learn it from? Because it’s, you know, you said it's, you kinda jumped into this. You didn't know a lot about planned giving. Were there some folks that, that kinda taught you and explained to you how it works more, or did you kinda, like, learn on the way? How did that come about?
Tony: A lot of the value of a legal education is understanding how to research and do and learn something new. So, you know, someone who practices as a tax attorney, tax law may have a contracts issue. So, you learn how to research contracts law in your, in your state. So, some of it was, a good amount was self-taught. I mean, I read books. One of the books is still up on my shelf. And others, I did learn from some people who were teaching planned giving courses. One of them was―he's no longer living―he was, I think, a pioneer in planned giving, Robert Sharp Senior. And he wrote a book called “Planned Giving Simplified.” He wrote that book later, but that book is also on my shelf. It's not one that I learned from, but I certainly kept it after I did read it. Robert Sharp, so he was a big influence.
And there's a little-known man―he's not a little man; he's a giant knowledge-wise but not well known outside tight, planned giving circles―and his name is John, Jonathan Tigg. He's an attorney, and I learned a lot from Jonathan Tigg as well.
Ronnie: What did they teach you that wasn't in the books or wasn't something that you kinda self-taught from learning the law and the legal side of it, the research.
Tony: From Robert Sharp, I learned the relationship side. That was not in this big probably this is planned giving. Yeah. That's probably a 500-page book. The, you know, they touched on the relationships but mostly a technical book. I don't think it's written for lawyers, but it helps that I am a lawyer, and I was a lawyer when I was reading that book in my early years in Planned Giving.
So, from Robert Sharp, the relationship side. It's all about people; it's all about listening to people, being curious, being curious about people. You know, if you have a curiosity about anything, you'll explore it. And I have a curiosity about people. And I like exploring their histories, their stories, their past, you know, whatever you wanna call it. So, from him, I learned that relationship, the value of relationships. And, you know, through the years, you know, I've formed relationships with donors, of course, with coworkers, former coworkers.
And I'm the relationship guy. You know, I just, I'm the guy who still gets our high school class together. Going back to, if I could find our elementary school, I'd probably go back there because I had a crush on that little girl named Annie. In fourth grade in Rutherford, New Jersey. If I could find her, you know, I would probably get in touch with her too. But high school is the best I can do. Yeah, so high school, college, law school, Air Force. I'm the Air Force reunion organizing guy. My fraternity in college. Yeah, I put that reunion together every year.
It's just, so relationships come naturally to me, and you could call it a curiosity of people, but a lot of, for a lot of folks, it's just, I’m just, you know, I'm the gum on your shoe. I just, I won't go away until you tell me, stop organizing these damn reunions.
Justin: And I think the curiosity is, is such an interesting note, Tony, because, you know, so you have a very growing and successful planned giving practice that started, you know, around 2003. And then seven years later, that curiosity, in part influenced by stand-up comedy, leads you to the launch of nonprofit radio. So, talk to us about how that came about, the idea and getting it off the ground. And then, you know, connecting the dots back to the curiosity side.
Tony: I gotta tell you guys, this is so much fun. I never … nobody ever talks to me about this.
Justin: That’s what we’re here for, man.
Ronnie: You're always asking the questions, right? Yeah.
Tony: No. I am. Well, on my podcast, certainly. Yeah. But no, I appreciate your interest in my background. Thank you. Thank you.
Justin: You're so welcome.
Tony: What was the question? No, I remember the question. So, the few things going to the podcast, you know. Yes, I have I've done stand-up comedy. I've taken stand-up comedy classes, but I've also performed stand-up comedy. I performed taking classes and performed improvisation, group improv, you know, I, so these are all the factors that go into the creation of the podcast.
I look at, you know, when I see a microphone standing alone, I don't care if it's floor stand or on a table, to me, an empty mic looks like a lonely friend. I have to go and talk to it. I just I'm drawn to empty mics. So, that helps, curiosity about people, of course.
They talked about love of planned giving, but the podcast goes way beyond planned giving. But love of, so love of generally supporting small and mid-sized nonprofits. My practice is planned giving. I teach an online course, Planned Giving Accelerator, you know―my company is Martignetti Planned Giving Advisors. I'm all in on planned giving.
But beyond that, you know, nonprofits struggle with a lot more than just planned giving. A lot more than just fundraising. And so, I wanted to help small and mid-sized nonprofits with everything that they struggle with. So, my curiosity of people leads me to pick their brains, people who are experts in all the other areas that I'm not. And that's broad. I'm narrowing deep in planned giving. But if you wanna go beyond that, if you wanna talk about monthly sustainer giving, I need an expert. You wanna talk about board relationships, legal, technology, social media, marketing, communications, branding, volunteer management, your board relationships, all those and lots more, you know, lots more topics, I need to pick the brains of experts. So put all those things together.
Justin: With the launch of the radio. I mean, like, yeah, you know, this, this is a big stew that kinda comes together.
Tony: Right. And then podcasting was emerging. And, you know, I bought a mic, and it was lonely, so I started talking to it with other people. Podcasting was emerging as a, as a method and, you know, going back to my high school days, I was, I needed to talk to microphones, so you put all that together, and I thought, well, you know, what the hell? I don't, I don't know podcasting, but I've learned other things. I can learn that too. So, I had no idea what I was doing. You know, the conventional wisdom, I guess, was supposed to have six shows lined up in advance so people see that there's a, you know, some archive, some value to the program. You're not just gonna be a one-off. Well, I didn't do that. I did one a week, and so I probably lost half of my listeners. I lost a lot of listeners because I didn't have six. Week one, I had one. Week two, I had two, etcetera.
But now we're in week 650, and we’ve got 650 shows. So, I guess I figured it out along the way.
Justin: Yeah. Yeah. I’m curious about some of the lessons that you've learned through the 650 shows just, you know, in terms of, obviously, you're always learning through the guests that you bring on. And the various areas of the nonprofit space that you tackle. But, specifically, about production of the creation of a podcast and especially one that that has grown to the extent and the reach that yours has. Who were some of the people that you looked at? What were some of the lessons that you've drawn from that experience over the last thirteen years?
Tony: Lesson number one is probably consistency: Just I do a show. I'm committed to doing a show every single week. Fifty a year. I take two weeks off around the holidays. That helps me. That’s why I'm not putting it off. You know, it's a busy week, you know, ends up being a busy month.
Well, now it's been a busy eight months or eight weeks, and now I have to apologize in my next show for being away for two months. Meanwhile, people drop off. So, consistency helps me, you know, I'm just, I'm committed to it once a week. It has to be done.
It also helps me attract sponsors. I've been very lucky that I've had lots of corporate sponsors through the years, helps offset the expenses of going to NTC, that Nonprofit Technology Conference that you asked about, Justin, lots of sponsors, corporate sponsors through the years. And they like consistency.
They wanna know that, you know, if you wanna attract sponsors to your podcast, I think consistency and also longevity are valuable because a sponsor isn't gonna want something that they're not gonna know the production schedule of. They don't even know, well, in six months, how many episodes are we gonna get?
You'll probably get around eight or ten, but you know, we're not sure. That's no good, you know. So, six months, you know you're gonna get 25 episodes.
Other than that―go ahead. I'm sorry.
Ronnie: I was gonna say, in the, in the theme of curiosity that we have going here, I'm curious, 13 years of doing this in 650 episodes, there have to be some really fun stories or really memorable guests that you've had on. Can you think of, like, a story that you could share? You know, it could be anonymous if you don't wanna name the person or whatever. But, yeah, what do you, what do you have in in terms of fun stories from doing this?
Tony: The time that Beth Cantor said **** on my show twice; twice.
She was talking about a nonprofit. I think it's called ****sharks, I think. I could be wrong about that, but she said it twice, and, you know, I kept it. You know, she was embarrassed, but then she said it again. So she must have doubled down. So, you must not have been too embarrassed. That was years ago. I think that was at a conference. I'm pretty sure I was talking to her at one of the nonprofit technology conferences. Years ago; years ago. So that's, you know, the lighthearted moment. You can go to tonymartignetti.com. You could search Beth's name and all her appearances would come up. And I, I didn't flag it as, ‘This is the show where Beth Cantor says ****,’ so you're gonna have to listen to it. You're gonna have to listen to several because she's been on a bunch of times. But, yeah, there was a time that we were at a different conference. I don't think this was a Nonprofit Technology Conference.
Through the years, I have explored other conferences, but I just end up sticking with Nonprofit Technology Conference because they, they're the ones who see the value of working with me the most. But I think, I think this was a different conference.
The woman, this woman was just having a bad day, and she, she walked off. You know, I was just, I was just asking her normal questions about her area of expertise, which would have been what her seminar topic was about at this conference.
And yeah, you know, I, I felt terrible, but I wasn't putting upon her any more than any other guests, just she was having a bad day. And she, after, I don't know, five or seven minutes, just walked off, she couldn't do it. Couldn't do it.
Ronnie: Just, no comment, just walk. Just straight up, just drop the mic and walk.
Tony: Took her, took her headset off, got up out of the chair and said, “I can't do this.” So … and I felt bad for her, you know? At first, I was flustered, and then I just felt bad. So that was, you know, that's unusual. You know, I used to …
Justin: That's where, that's where those improv skills come in, though.
Tony: Yeah. I don't know. I was, well, these were recordings. These were all recordings.
Justin: Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Tony: You know, I just didn't use the recording. I'm certain you're still out on that one. I didn’t want to embarrass them. Yeah. That was just a right. Oh, that just that, just never got released. I used to do a show in a studio in New York City the first several years. So, 2010 to probably 2017 or so, 18, even. Even after I left New York City and I moved to North Carolina, I kept using the studio. We would connect on, I think we, I think he used Facebook live to connect us. So, for many years, I had a studio connection, and the show was live every Friday.
So, I liked, I liked having a live audience. Small, you know, maybe fifteen people listening live or something. The vast majority was always the podcast. But so, once a studio guest came in huffing and puffing, he was overweight. Subway was running late, You had to walk up a bunch of stairs to get to our studio, he was running down the hall, he was running down the streets, and then he ran up the stairs, and he was, he needed a few minutes to get the, get the flush out of his face. Had a drink of water, you know, I was a little concerned about my, you know, my boy scout CPR skills, I think, to come to, come to the fore, but he was okay. He was okay. And we, and now we laugh about it. I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna embarrass him because I don't, I don't wanna embarrass him, but he and I laugh about it. We've laughed about it on the show since then. He's certainly the best.
His heart is fine. Just a little flustered at the, at the moment. Little, yeah, little red, red-faced.
Justin: Little red-faced. You know, the thing about it is, I think, you know, even, the longer that, that you do something, right? You do develop that, that list of moments, and they become Canon. As a part of the, you know, with, you know, with you and those guests, with you and the team.
And I know Ronnie and I can attest to the same thing, you know, a handful of years behind you of just, you just have those kinda funny moments that pop up over time. And so … but, you know, even to this day, Tony, the nonprofit radio isn't your only gig. You've got Planned Giving Accelerator, you continue to do planned giving courses on the consulting side. And so, you know, I'm, I would love for you to share both from the Planned Giving Accelerator side now, as you look back, and the nonprofit radio side now. Not necessarily the funny moments but just kind of some of the seminal moments, and especially the folks that have left a mark on you, that you're carrying forward. You know, you mentioned Sharp and others, but just curious as you think about the work that you continue to do, who are the people that you have, that you have been impacted by, and what are the lessons that you are hoping to impart on those that you encounter as you think about the impact that you're making on others in your consulting work and in your podcast work?
Tony: What a gracious question. Thank you, Justin. That's good. Thank you. Thank you.
You know, I have two tracks to my work. I'm a planned giving consultant fundraising consultant, and so nonprofits can hire me on a retainer basis, and I help them launch or grow their planned giving. And then I also have Planned Giving Accelerator, which is an online course that I teach just once a year, every March through end of May. So, it's just three months: March, April, May. The next one will be in 2024. And so, the memorable folks come from those two different tracks. And I would say, on the consulting side, it's the donors, that's who stay with me. You know, there's a healthcare agency that I work for in New York City, and one of their donors is 99 years old.
I was with her on her 99th birthday last year, and I hope I'll be with her for her 100th birthday this year. And she's just an inspiration. She lives alone. She has her mental faculties for the most part. She's more forgetful than most of us, in details, but she's 99 years old. But she's able to live alone, take care of herself, I find that so inspiring, you know, so moving. She's content in her life. She has her papers, the newspapers that she reads, she has opera recordings that she listens to, She's just, she's found contentment at 99 That’s, as I said, inspirational. And I'll even shout her out, just her first name: Marion. First name is Marion.
And then on the Planned Giving Accelerator side, I'm on the consulting side. There are certainly other donors who inspire me too. Just that they're older, they're in their eighties or nineties, Yeah, I should mention these folks. They've made a life. Obviously, they're all retired, but they've made lives that they're enjoying for the most part. Some folks don't enjoy that. Some folks become infirm in their eighties and nineties. Or even earlier, seventies. But most folks have made a life of contentment for themselves. And that's, really, it moves me to just find contentment in my life even today. I don't have to wait till I turn 75 to be content. So, I aspire to contentment. You know, that's why I live on the beach. The ocean is across the street. If I look that way, instead of at you two, I can see the ocean.
And it's there every day. It's very reassuring. It's there every morning I wake up.
So, a life of contentment, you know, around my consulting and the other work I do. And then on the Planned Giving Accelerator side, I'd say the inspirations have been some of the alumni who have raised literally millions of dollars from what they've learned through the accelerator. There's a small humane society in a small town in Georgia. I could shout them out, I think. She's proud of the work. Athens Area Humane Society, Athens, Georgia. Cheryl McCormick is the CEO. She was the person from the humane society that was in my accelerator course, and she's raised over four, close to four-and-a-half million dollars in planned gift commitments from what she learned in the accelerator. And that’s enormous. That’s, it's a small agency. I think their annual budget is, I know their annual budget is under a million dollars. I think it's like a half or three-quarters of a million dollars, their annual budget. They've got over four, close to four-and-a-half million dollars in commitments.
Justin: That's incredible.
Tony: So, and that, now that's an outlier. She's done very, very well, but there's another small agency in Oregon that's raised 265,000 dollars in commitments.
There's an organization outside Illinois, outside Chicago, Illinois, I think, that's also a humane society. About two-and-a-half million dollars in commitments. An arts agency in New York City, 65 thousand dollars in commitments. And then plus a lifetime gift: Somebody, they were talking about a planned gift, and someone committed to a lifetime, made a lifetime gift while they were talking about the planned gift commitment that the person also made. So, you know, these kinds of outcomes. Five new board gifts at another organization. It was a child development agency that happened to also be in Georgia. Five new board gifts from what she learned in Planned Giving Accelerator. So, those alumni experiences move me on the accelerator side.
Justin: That's incredible, man. I mean, like, and I think you know, Tony, one of the things that Ronnie and I love about these conversations is that as we, as we explore someone's journey and path, there's always this thing that just kinda, it just loops back. And, you know, something that I appreciate that we're hearing from you is the loop of curiosity into coaching, into inspiration. And that there's a cycle that happens there in your work, and how you've put your life towards the nonprofit space, whether or not that's on the planned giving side or even through the conversations that you have on the radio side, and that's worth celebrating, worth noting. So, we really do appreciate what you do and the part of the public square that you occupy in, you know, the nonprofit land of helping spur organizations on and tell great stories for sure.
Tony: Thank you. Thanks very much, Justin. Appreciate it. Thanks for hosting. Ronnie, thank you.
Justin: Yeah. We're super thankful for you sharing some time with us today. If any of our listeners want to connect with you, find out more about the planned giving work, or listen to the radio program, where can they find you?
Tony: You can reach me directly if you like. Use my email, Tony at tony@martignetti.com if you wanna learn about Tony Martignetti or Nonprofit Radio, my podcast. That's at tonymartignetti.com. If you wanna learn more about the Planned Giving Accelerator, it's at the aptly named site, plannedgivingaccelerator.com.
Ronnie: Perfect.
Justin: Awesome. Alright, man, thank you so much. Thanks for hanging out with us today. We really, it wasn't nearly as intimidating as Ronnie thought it was gonna be.
Tony: Thanks to each of you. I really, I do appreciate your interest in my background. Thanks to each of you. Thanks, Ronnie. Thanks, Justin.
Group Thinkers is a production of RKD Group. For more information, including how you can partner with RKD to accelerate growth for your fundraising and nonprofit marketing needs, visit rkdgroup.com.