--- title: Ben Labay thinks about conversion optimization description: On this episode of the Groupthinkers podcast, we sat down with Ben Labay to discuss conversion optimization and testing tactics to improve the donor journey. image: https://blog.rkdgroup.com/hubfs/210108-RKD-Ben-Labay-thinks-about-conversion-optimization-Doodle-v2.jpg --- [![](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/hs-fs/hubfs/210111-RKD-Groupthinkers-Rebranded-Logo-Blog-png.png?width=157&name=210111-RKD-Groupthinkers-Rebranded-Logo-Blog-png.png)](https://blog.rkdgroup.com) - [Solutions](https://rkdgroup.com/services/) - [Mid-Level Giving](https://rkdgroup.com/services/mid-level-giving/) - [Monthly Giving](https://rkdgroup.com/services/monthly-giving/) - [Lapsed Giving](https://rkdgroup.com/services/lapsed-giving/) - [Personalization](https://rkdgroup.com/services/personalization/) - [Connectors](https://rkdgroup.com/services/connectors/) - [Machine Learning](https://rkdgroup.com/services/machine-learning/) - [Marketing + Fundraising](https://rkdgroup.com/services/marketing-fundraising/) - [Audience Development](https://rkdgroup.com/services/audience-development/) - [Creative Services](https://rkdgroup.com/services/creative-services/) - [Data Management](https://rkdgroup.com/services/data-management/) - [Strategic Planning](https://rkdgroup.com/services/strategic-planning/) - [Analytics](https://rkdgroup.com/services/analytics/) - [Causes](https://rkdgroup.com/causes/) - [Animal Care](https://rkdgroup.com/causes/animal-care/) - [Food Banks](https://rkdgroup.com/causes/food-banks/) - [Health + Hospitals](https://rkdgroup.com/causes/health-hospitals/) - [Humanitarian](https://rkdgroup.com/causes/humanitarian/) - [Missions](https://rkdgroup.com/causes/missions/) - [Salvation Army](https://rkdgroup.com/causes/the-salvation-army/) - [Results](https://rkdgroup.com/results/) - [Acquisition](https://rkdgroup.com/results?cat=acquisition) - [Digital](https://rkdgroup.com/results?cat=digital) - [Mid-Major Programs](https://rkdgroup.com/results?cat=mid-major-programs) - [Advanced Analytics](https://rkdgroup.com/results?cat=advanced-analytics) - [Direct Mail](https://rkdgroup.com/results?cat=direct-mail) - [Multichannel Strategy](https://rkdgroup.com/results?cat=multichannel-strategy) - [Data Management](https://rkdgroup.com/results?cat=data-management) - [Media](https://rkdgroup.com/results?cat=media) - [Website Development](https://rkdgroup.com/results?cat=website-development) - [Resources](https://rkdgroup.com/insights/) - [Blog](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/) - [Benchmarks](https://info.rkdgroup.com/benchmarks) - [Webinars](https://info.rkdgroup.com/webinars) - [Ebooks + Research](https://info.rkdgroup.com/ebooks-research) - [Podcast](https://info.rkdgroup.com/group-thinkers-nonprofit-marketing-podcast) - [Field Guides](https://info.rkdgroup.com/field-guides) - [About Us](https://rkdgroup.com/about/) - [Leadership](https://rkdgroup.com/about/leadership/) - [Careers](https://rkdgroup.com/about/careers/) - [Let's Chat](https://rkdgroup.com/lets-chat/) #### Subscribe to our blog ### Subscribe to Email Updates ## Featured Post   [RKD Group](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/author/rkd-group) ## [RKD Group Acquires Whiteboard](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/rkd-group-acquires-whiteboard) Premier Marketing Agency Bolsters Conceptual Creative Capabilities by Acquiring Award-Winning Agency PLANO, Texas, July 27, 2026 — Today, RKD Group, Nor\[...\] [Digital Fundraising](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/digital-fundraising) [Direct Mail Fundraising](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/direct-mail-fundraising) [Multichannel](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/multichannel) [Fundraising](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/fundraising) [Nonprofit Industry](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/nonprofit-industry) [RKD](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/rkd) [Brand](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/brand) [Read More](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/rkd-group-acquires-whiteboard)   [Shane Thornal](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/author/shane-thornal) ## [Why nonprofits must unite SEO, social and paid media in one strategy](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/why-nonprofits-must-unite-seo-social-and-paid-media-in-one-strategy) Someone at your organization “owns” paid media. Someone else—often younger and under resourced—runs the social accounts. A third person (or maybe no one\[...\] [Digital Fundraising](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/digital-fundraising) [SEO](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/seo) [Digital Media](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/digital-media) [Social Media](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/social-media) [Data & Analytics](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/data-analytics) [Read More](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/why-nonprofits-must-unite-seo-social-and-paid-media-in-one-strategy) ## Recent Posts [Podcast](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/podcast) [Conversion](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/conversion) [Strategy](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/strategy) [Data & Analytics](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/topic/data-analytics) # Ben Labay thinks about conversion optimization By [RKD Group](https://blog.rkdgroup.com/author/rkd-group) > *“When you think about an optimization program, it’s all about solving problems or resolving lost opportunities.”* > > *- Ben Labay, Research Director at CXL Agency* ### CONVERSION OPTIMIZATION FOR NONPROFITS On this episode of Groupthinkers, host Justin McCord is joined by Research Director at CXL Agency Ben Labay as he thinks about conversion science and optimizing the donor experience. Labay outlines the importance of using data to understand your audience before taking action and shares a road map to optimization for nonprofit organizations. What to think about: - Understanding donor motivation and optimizing to capitalize off it - Using conversion science to stay focused on the donor - How to improve testing efforts   ### WANT MORE? Groupthinkers is the [podcast for nonprofit marketers](https://rkdgroup.com/podcast/) by RKD Group. This is a must-listen experience of thought-provoking content that inspires insight on the industry and strategic decisions. Groupthinkers brings together innovators and curators in nonprofit marketing, branding and direct response to tackle the major issues facing nonprofits today. Be sure to tune in for Season 3, as we drop new episodes each Tuesday over the next few months. 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